Author Topic: Parts  (Read 9686 times)

Richard Cavalloro

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Parts
« on: March 24, 2015, 10:54:26 AM »
I had been going through older posts here, especially the Dairy Car thread.   A question came to me.   I know the museum can build rolling stock pretty well.  The wood and fasteners aren't really a problem from what I see.   Truck frames can be fabricated.  Where does the museum get wheel sets and couplers?   I know there was some existing from the original railway but where would we source more?   
 

Rick
 (Maybe over thinking something again)

Roger Cole

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Re: Parts
« Reply #1 on: March 24, 2015, 08:59:27 PM »
I know that the Sandstone Heritage Estate in South Africa has collected lots of 2-foot gauge rolling stock from abandoned lines in their country, presumably available for the right price (not to mention locomotives as well).  I know that the Welsh Highland Railway has received several of their gondolas.  I'm not sure if their couplers would match the U.S. couplers.  Their list of rolling stock is as follows:  http://www.sandstone-estates.com/index.php/sandstone-inventory/65-railway-inventory/3008-latest-sandstone-stock-list

Alan Downey

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Re: Parts
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2015, 11:44:31 PM »
I hope Jason won't mind me chiming in on this. We know of commercial sources in the U.S. for both wheels and couplers. However, there are also a few pattern makers at the WW&F, so we are always looking for ways that we can produce our own versions of parts as well.
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john d Stone

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Re: Parts
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2015, 12:32:59 AM »
I was wondering, did all the two footers use steel wheels, or did some early equipment have chilled iron wheel sets?

Philip Marshall

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Re: Parts
« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2015, 02:00:22 AM »
According to Jerry DeVos's books, the SR&RL used chilled iron wheels pretty much exclusively, even on newer equipment (he cites ICC records as the source for this), and I suspect that what was true for the SR&RL would be true for the other Two-Footers as well.

-Philip Marshall

john d Stone

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Re: Parts
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2015, 08:07:40 AM »
Thanks Philip. Does any of the current museum equipment have such wheels? As I understand it, iron wheels have to be ground to re-profile as opposed to turning  against a cutting tool.

Gordon Cook

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Re: Parts
« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2015, 08:23:53 AM »
Jason has the details, but I believe the short answer is lack of available existing stock, and the cost of buying 8 wheels, 4 axles, and 2 sets of coupler castings. It gets expensive. I know we've been thinking about it for quite a while and have made attempts to secure both wheels and couplers as they were rumored to be available. There are some original parts around, but the owner(s) ain't interested in selling them as of yet.
When the need for trucks rises to the top of the list, we'll figure out what the best approach is.

(BTW, it's "Pots")  ;)
« Last Edit: March 25, 2015, 08:28:57 AM by Gordon Cook »
Gawdon

Richard Cavalloro

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Re: Parts
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2015, 08:42:56 AM »
LOL Gordon...    People make fun of our RI dialect, never mind Maine.    You kind of hit the nail on the head though.  I assumed running gear would tough to find.   So any talk of new rolling stock gets pricey.....
    Rick

Jason M Lamontagne

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Re: Parts
« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2015, 09:41:59 AM »
Sorry to be late to the discussion.

As far as I know the original Maine two footers exclusively used chilled tread cast iron wheels- some by Griffon, some by Portland Co. 

Edaville's replacement wheels were forged steel- the modern standard.  We also have purchased some of these- for our caboose and for one replacement wheel set for coach 3. 

5 years ago the price per wheel (not wheel set, one wheel) was about $2100.  So any new piece of rolling stock involves around $17,000 just for wheels (probably more today).

We are considering producing wheels "in house" by making a pattern matching the old Po Co wheels, having them cast by steel, gardening, then machining ourselves.  We'll have to compare total cost.  We'll also have a more historically correct wheel.

Couplers- same story.  3/4 couplers are commercially available- around $2000 each.  We've also considered making a pattern for this.

We currently have two new couplers in hiding here at the shop- which we are saving for the coach replica project.  Which needs wheels...

See ya
Jason

Richard Cavalloro

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Re: Parts
« Reply #9 on: March 25, 2015, 09:59:41 AM »
Thanks Jason.  I guess I'll add a little "extra" to the dues renewal this year 

john d Stone

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Re: Parts
« Reply #10 on: March 25, 2015, 10:41:03 AM »
Thanks Jason.
Looks like even at narrow gauge prices, railroad stuff is expensive!

Wayne Laepple

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Re: Parts
« Reply #11 on: March 25, 2015, 07:47:19 PM »
I'm curious how we'd get qualification on new wheels. While casting them isn't a big deal, I understand that properly cooling them is very important.

Jason M Lamontagne

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Re: Parts
« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2015, 07:19:53 AM »
There's a national standard for cast steel wheels- it hasn't been kept up to date but using the latest acceptable edition should be acceptable (the FRA accepts the 1953 ASME Sec III, Locomotive Boilers, for example).

We'd examine the standard, determine equivalences for any materials or processes no longer valid. 

Normalizing (controlled second heat to normalizing temperature and controlled cooling) is a standard procedure for all steel castings.  We'd jdt be looking for any additional or particular requirements in the wheel spec.

The most important part of wheel manufacture is NDE.  Today's methods are far advanced over those from when the spec was adopted.  We'd probably use a UT shear wave examination.

Lastly- remember our rolling stock won't need qualification like it would for a car in commercial passenger service: 49CFR Pt 238.3(3) exempts our type of operation specifically.  If we show that we are voluntarily adopting the most relevant standard available,  and following it as much as modern equivalency allows, we shouldn't expect a problem. 

See ya
Jason

Wayne Laepple

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Re: Parts
« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2015, 04:25:03 PM »
Thanks for that explanation, Jason. Next question: we don't have a boring mill, so how would we bore the wheels?

Jason M Lamontagne

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Re: Parts
« Reply #14 on: March 27, 2015, 12:27:02 PM »
The right tool, really, is a vertical turret lathe- which we also don't have.  The shop down the road has a horizontal boring mill, which is the machine that bored no 9's cylinders and sleeves.  It isn't partularly well suited to wheel work.

We could either find a vertical turret lathe, make a jig to to the job safely on our 48" lathe, or hire it out.  At this point I'd lean towards tooling up our big lathe to do the job. 

See ya
Jason