W.W.&F. Discussion Forum

WW&F Railway Museum Discussion => Volunteers => Topic started by: James Patten on April 01, 2020, 06:52:22 AM

Title: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: James Patten on April 01, 2020, 06:52:22 AM
I'm starting this topic not to necessarily report on work coming up or accomplished, but mainly to keep the continuity of topics.

With Maine's stay at home order for the month of April, it means that the only official thing occurring this month will be the board meeting on the 11th.

Stay safe and healthy, everyone!
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Fred Morse on April 08, 2020, 02:16:27 AM
Nice to see many people coming by the museum and walking our tracks while their staying home. Good to get out in fresh air I guess. Were keeping an eye on the place which is good. Getting a little done anyhow.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: James Patten on April 08, 2020, 06:50:46 AM
Virtual board meeting this coming Saturday the 11th, starting at 4.  Contact Ed Lecuyer if you'd like to virtually attend.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Mike Fox on April 11, 2020, 01:05:25 PM
I decided since the stay at home order is in effect, it is a good time to work on one of my home projects..hy-rail gear..intended for the Kubota..eventually..

I picked these up last year in Avon, Me. I spent a few hours this morning and brought one set in to the proper gauge.

(https://i.postimg.cc/ZRNxhp0G/0411200941.jpg)

This is the heavier set with brakes. Electric over hydraulic. Pump is there too.

(https://i.postimg.cc/gjvs38WV/0411200944.jpg)

Got the set I was working on all set on steel saw horses, anf figured where I wanted to cut..then cut. Here is after my torch effort..

(https://i.postimg.cc/MZR9k2Qn/0411201032.jpg)

Cut and tapered

(https://i.postimg.cc/CxvNCwWQ/0411201044.jpg)

Slid both sides together and snap clamped them to a piece of angle for alaignment. Lined up a lot easier than I had figured.

(https://i.postimg.cc/8CjbtqGP/0411201052.jpg)

Welded and ready for some free handed fish plates..

(https://i.postimg.cc/VksgbJHt/0411201118.jpg)

Paint..

(https://i.postimg.cc/pd4J7qVQ/0411201123.jpg)

Finished all sides with small fish plates. The way the axle is designed, there is minimal stress where the weld is, but a little reinforcement never hurts.

(https://i.postimg.cc/zXFpBCp5/0411201202.jpg)

Back on the other axle to get a size comparison, Sheepscot Standard gauge vs. Broad gauge..

(https://i.postimg.cc/wTp0gfX0/0411201228.jpg0)

Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Bill Baskerville on April 11, 2020, 01:37:28 PM
Nice Mike, are they for the Kubota so we can finally use that neat articulated underwater grass cutting arm we procured a few years ago to keep the ROW cleared?
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Jeff Schumaker on April 11, 2020, 02:24:55 PM
NIce work, Mike. Will these wheels be a bolt on attachment to the Kubota?

Jeff S.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Philip Marshall on April 11, 2020, 03:05:01 PM
Really nice, Mike.

I picked these up last year in Avon, Me.

I'm surprised they weren't the correct gauge already, coming from SR&RL territory.  :)

Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Mike Fox on April 11, 2020, 04:37:32 PM
Yes, they will be for the Kubota. The idea is to make a mount that will hook to the blade. The other set will need a sub frame that will then bolt to the rear frame of the Kubota. This is made so we can remove the railgear when not needed.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Mike Fox on April 25, 2020, 07:02:32 PM
Making emergency repairs to the railroad..

Track is now out of service from Sheepscot North Yard Limit, north.

(https://i.postimg.cc/zvYPZn0t/0425201148.jpg)

This is why. Jason was alerted to this and found it last week and immediately called me.

(https://i.postimg.cc/nhFghGZN/0425201136.jpg)

So I got looking and found this. It looks like the joint on the main pipe under the track has collapsed. There also appears to be a puncture when peering in from the west side.

(https://i.postimg.cc/sfWt62wH/0425201137.jpg)

The track sags over the pipe.

(https://i.postimg.cc/3xt640xN/0425201136a.jpg)

So, after helping with the roof, I shuffled some supplies to the sites (yes, there are 2 failing pipes within about 500 feet of each other)

(https://i.postimg.cc/T1nFpkKv/0425200825.jpg)

(https://i.postimg.cc/DZ9RfVyc/0425201109.jpg)

(https://i.postimg.cc/5NMDZMr4/0425201133.jpg)

Then hauled the Kubota up with Freds truck and started digging.

(https://i.postimg.cc/bN8Fm9Gd/0425201418a.jpg)

I dug for only about 20 minutes, then taped off the area to keep walkers away from the hole.

(https://i.postimg.cc/sDcHqGSm/0425201548.jpg)

Next weekend I will replace the main pipe. I want to reuse the shorter one I uncovered, so I will try to leave it in place.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Bill Baskerville on April 25, 2020, 07:33:57 PM
What a shame that in the middle of the SWW the rail heads at the Sheepscot yard limits are rusty. 

I miss our railroad....

Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Eric Larsen on April 26, 2020, 02:24:46 PM
I wonder if the plastic culverts are an issue?
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Bill Reidy on April 26, 2020, 03:38:01 PM
The fill looks like it has a lot of clay in Mike's 8th photo.  Not very stable in freeze/thaw cycles, I imagine.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Mike Fox on April 26, 2020, 04:35:45 PM
The clay is definately an issue. It freezes and thaws more than good draining soil, and is soft and pliable when wet.

But, we can not change it. If we put good draining soil in over the culverts, it will change the freeze of the ground in such a way that it would cause a dip in the winter. Then there is a potential for uncoupling or worse.
Packing the culvert tight with soil will help minimize the potential for settling and culvert movement. My plan is to disturb as little as necessary to get the culverts in, which helps in the settling of the pipes.

If we switch to steel, they only last about 25 years, so not as long as a plastic (is supposed to) lasts.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Graham Buxton on April 26, 2020, 04:37:04 PM
I have  36" X 20ft 'plastic' culvert that I installed in my driveway 13 years ago. It has performed well with no issues.  We do get some freeze cycles here, but the 'building code' frost depth here is only 12 inches, so freeze cycles are clearly less severe than at Sheepscot. 

My plastic culvert has 'wavy ridges' on the exterior, but the inside of the culvert is smooth. I notice in Mike's photo that in the 'inside' culvert photo that the ridges are plainly visible.  That suggests the installed culvert is a single wall version, and [hopefully] a doublewall style (with a smooth inside) is available as a replacement.

The other issue is that the photo shows the installed culvert is oval, rather than round.  If it was not manufactured in that shape, in my opinion, :) some of the structural strength of  a perfect circle design is lost.  Note that the failure is at the top of the flattened area.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Bill Baskerville on April 26, 2020, 04:48:38 PM
Graham,  I suspect the culverts were round when installed, as were the two just south of Alna Center that we had to change about 10 years ago.  Between the freeze thaw cycles, the clay, the weight of the locomotives, etc.  the side fill slowly moves so the pipes become oval shaped.  I know on the Alna Center pipes we spent a lot of time compacting the fill around the sides of the pipes to prevent this.  I haven't looked inside to see if they are again compressing. 

I know that life and construction techniques in Maine are vastly different than where some of us mid-Atlantic folks live.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Graham Buxton on April 26, 2020, 04:54:31 PM
If the clay backfill is the issue behind the culvert getting flattened, then perhaps the backfill should be a more stable material, like quarry rock, compacted with a rental plate compactor, or a 'jump' style compactor. Yes it costs more, but how many times do we want to fix the same culvert?

ADS is a manufacturer of various sizes of HDPE pipes.  You may be familiar with their 4" black flex drain that is typically available at the various 'big box' home improvement stores, but they also manufacture bigger culverts up to 60" in diameter.  I note that they offer various documents for download, but I thought the Installation Guide titled "Trench_Installation_Railway_4in_to_60in_HDPE_Pipe_(Detail_107A_01-16)-Model" may be interesting reading. 8)

Its too big to directly post here, but this is the host page:
https://www.ads-pipe.com/markets/timber/culverts (https://www.ads-pipe.com/markets/timber/culverts)
Scroll down to the desired document name.  The "ASTM D2321 Class 1" backfill referenced therein is crushed rock, but there are also alternative backfills listed.



Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Bill Reidy on April 26, 2020, 05:45:24 PM
If we switch to steel, they only last about 25 years, so not as long as a plastic (is supposed to) lasts.

This culvert dates back at least 20 years, as the track here, coming out of Cockeye Curve to Sheepscot Mills crossing, was built in early April 2001.  It was my first work weekend.  My first job was to shovel leftover snow from the right-of-way (Dana might remember the story).  The culvert site wasn't bad, but it was deep mud in the area between the whistle post and the crossing.  Lots and lots of clay.  My first introduction, as I grew up near the sandy soil of Cape Cod.

What a shame that in the middle of the SWW the rail heads at the Sheepscot yard limits are rusty. 

I miss our railroad....

That was my first thought when I saw Mike's photos, Bill.  I went out and burned brush yesterday to commiserate.  Unlike many past years, I didn't get to do that this past winter in Alna.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Mike Fox on April 27, 2020, 08:51:23 AM
When the culverts were installed, everything was loose. Now all that ground has settled and compacted. Since I relieved the pressure on the top of the pipe, I can now stretch it like I did the 4' pipes down the mountain, packing more material around the sides. We will see what Saturday brings. I may have to pull that short piece anyway, and if I do I'll just turn it.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: John L Dobson on April 27, 2020, 12:08:50 PM
Would encasing the plastic pipe in a lean concrete mix help reduce the crushing forces?
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Mike Fox on April 27, 2020, 01:14:08 PM
It would, but that brings another problem or 2. How to get the cement in there. Then it would be difficult to repair if there was another issue.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Graham Buxton on April 27, 2020, 02:52:16 PM
Mike, this wouldn't be particularly helpful transporting concrete, but what do you think about adding a 'dump bed' capability to the Museum's pickup?   It seems like the pickup (with rock / dirt) could transported on the rail wheel equipment trailer that gets used to move the dozer etc.   I don't know how long the sloped end of the trailer compares to the distance of the pickup wheels to the end of the pickup bed (where the dump hinge would be), so that would need to be evaluated, or perhaps just back pickup off the trailer to dump where the roadbed permits. 

Here is an example product: https://www.piercearrowinc.com/product-category/dump-kits/ (https://www.piercearrowinc.com/product-category/dump-kits/)
I'm not promoting a specific product / vendor, the link is just for discussion.

If you thought adding that capability to the Museum's pickup would be useful (and used), we could likely find a way to pay for it.  I would not expect that the pickup would be used to haul rock from a quarry, just used to move material around the WW&F property. And yes, I understand that a dump bed on that pickup isn't going to be functional in time to use it to fix this particular culvert. :)

Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: John McNamara on April 27, 2020, 04:51:15 PM
I noticed that the website that Graham cited was www.piercearrow.com. I thought that name was familiar, so I did a Google search. How about modifying a Pierce-Arrow car with a dump body?
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: James Patten on April 27, 2020, 05:48:56 PM
The Musuem's white truck (formerly Copeland Lumber) has a dump body.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Mike Fox on April 27, 2020, 06:33:10 PM
A dump body has been discussed for the pick up before, and would be very handy at times (hauling wood, debris, even unloading material from the lumber yard) around the museum.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Graham Buxton on April 27, 2020, 08:41:44 PM
From the perspective of getting rock to a 'rail only' location, (and not having a bunch of shovel-wielding minions :) available  to unload it) is the combination of the rail trailer and the white truck dump body suitable for the task, or would a dump bed on a pickup be more suitable?

Also I'm curious to know if the white truck has 'air brakes'? (If it does, then as I understand it, an 'air brake endorsement' on a driver's license would be required for anyone driving that truck on a public road.  While that may not matter for fixing culverts, it does tend to limit the pool of potential drivers for other, more mundane tasks.)
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Mike Fox on April 27, 2020, 08:59:51 PM
Only CDL license holders are allowed to drive the white truck on the road, and they have to be approved by me and put on our insurance plan. The pick up also has a set list of road drivers, because our insurance only allows so many drivers. Above the set amount, 8 if I remember correctly, the premium price increases.
Title: Re: April 2020 Work Reports
Post by: Pete "Cosmo" Barrington on April 27, 2020, 10:38:48 PM
With all this more modern equipment around, perhaps we should adopt a more modern (ok, ok, quit groaning until I finish please!) style logo ala the EDAville logo combining text with, say, a locomotive silhouette or some such.
Just a thought.... (and here's your shoe back!) ;)