W.W.&F. Discussion Forum
WW&F Railway Museum Discussion => Work and Events => Topic started by: Brendan Barry on July 18, 2019, 12:21:02 AM
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As part of the Narrow Gauge Railway Collection four passenger cars were moved from the Maine Narrow Gauge Railroad in Portland to the WW&FRy in Alna. Sandy River and Rangeley Lakes combine 14, coach 19, parlor car Rangeley, and Bridgeton and Saco River coach 16 arrived at the WW&FRy over the course of Tuesday and Wednesday. Maine Locomotive and Machine moved the cars with help from the MNGRR and WW&FRy crews.
The first move was SR&RL coach 19 Tuesday morning. Coach 19 is in need of some restoration work and is being stored at the WW&FRy for the time being.
Loading coach 19 from MNGRR's ramp track.
(https://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s5/bbarry74/car%20move/IMG_0303.jpg)
(https://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s5/bbarry74/car%20move/IMG_0305.jpg)
Coach 19 loaded up and leaving the Portland Company property.
(https://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s5/bbarry74/car%20move/IMG_0307.jpg)
(https://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s5/bbarry74/car%20move/IMG_0309.jpg)
The next move was the Rangeley Tuesday afternoon.
Moving the Rangeley on panel track from the car's display location inside the MNGRR museum to the garage door at the back of the museum building.
(https://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s5/bbarry74/car%20move/IMG_0311.jpg)
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The ML&M truck has arrived back from Alna and the Rangeley is winched outside and up onto the trailer. The truck has to park inside the building across the alley way to make the loading angle on the trailer deck work.
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The Rangeley out in the parking lot at the Portland Company.
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The Rangeley arrived at the WW&FRy in Alna around 9 pm and was unloaded onto the new ramp track.
(https://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s5/bbarry74/car%20move/IMG_0381.jpg)
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Marker lights were hung and everbody present rode the Rangeley from the end of the ramp track down through the north yard, out to the main, and back to bay 1 of the shop building. No. 9 was used to move the Rangeley over to the shop.
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Unloading the passengers and shoving the Rangeley into bay 1 of the shop building.
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Wednesday morning saw the move of SR&RL combine 14.
Combine 14 being moved out of the museum building and onto the trailer.
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Wednesday afternoon B&SR coach 16 was moved out of the museum and onto the trailer. To move 16 out of the museum we had to move the model T inspection car and Monson locomotive no. 4 out of the way.
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Turning off of Commercial St. and heading up Franklin St. in Portland.
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Eric Schade's pictures of the Rangeley, combine 14 and WW&F 9 / SR&RL 6 together in the Sheepscot yard Wednesday afternoon.
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(https://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s5/bbarry74/car%20move/es5.jpg)
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(https://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s5/bbarry74/car%20move/es1.jpg)
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Well done to everyone involved both over the last several months as well as the extremely long days you guys and gals put in. Seeing these cars together makes me really look forward to the future of both groups, and the wonderful things yet to come.
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I am very glad we can be a part of Maine Narrow Gauge's future. They have preserved Maine Two Foot history for 26 years, and we can help them continue on. No matter if the collection stays in Alna, or moves to a new location at some point, we have worked together, forming a continued bond between the two organizations that I hope lasts a long time.
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Very impressive that all those moves were accomplished smoothly and without incident. Thank you to everyone for all your efforts.
Questions:
Does anyone have or can point to pictures of the original move from Edaville to Portland?
When was the last time the Rangely was out of the museum building and was part of a train?
And...
What is the lever for on the rear platform?
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What is the lever for on the rear platform?
This one I know. It is the remnants of the Miller Coupler:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miller_Platform (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miller_Platform)
These were used on the SR&RL (and WW&F) during the transition from Link and Pin to Janney couplers. The platforms on WW&F coach 3 has similar remnants, but the lever itself has been removed.
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Regarding the building in Portland where the cars had been stored--is that property being repurposed for some other use? I assume that building was leased and not owned by MNGRR.
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Regarding the building in Portland where the cars had been stored--is that property being repurposed for some other use? I assume that building was leased and not owned by MNGRR.
Yes, the former Portland Company complex is being redeveloped. The most historic buildings (including the one that MNG was leasing for their exhibits and offices) are being repurposed, rehabilitated and incorporated into the new mixed-use development and marina. MNG has secured a long-term lease on the railroad right-of-way, and will be continuing (and expanding) their offerings along the Portland waterfront.
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Does anyone have or can point to pictures of the original move from Edaville to Portland?
There was a VHS tape produced called Moving Maine History (I think). I don't know if it ever came out in DVD format. I also think there are a few videos of the move on Youtube.
Jeff S.
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Thanks for the photos, Brendan. It's great to see the equipment running on the WW&F.
Jeff S.
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Hi Roger. The whole Portland Company parcel was sold a few years ago by the then owner and MNG co-founder Phin Sprague. MNG was able to continue their lease while plans were made and approved as to how develop the property. In the years since, there have been several drawings in the paper as to what was going to be built.
Today, the whole place looks different. I relate it to a war zone. Buildings being removed, and one being done so brick by brick to supposedly be reconstructed on the property. Yet, MNG continues it's daily existence through out it all. I could not imagine how tough it is on them.
The whole area there, all the way to India Street, has seen some huge growth in the last 5 to 10 years. Big buildings. Redesign of the Marine Terminal. Lots of activity.
I have seen so many designs for the property I forget what the final is.
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Are there going to be more moves to the WW&F?
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Are there going to be more moves to the WW&F?
Yes. This is just the beginning - but is of all the full-length coaches. The remaining moves will not require the trailer extension, which is cumbersome to add/remove to the ML&MW trailer.
Some of the equipment is going to ML&MW for storage/rehabilitation. Much will remain on the Sheepscot campus for outdoor display - including B&SR locomotive #8.
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Thank you
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Here's a video of the original move to Maine.
Mike Nix
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=crSSzDh2tms
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And another.....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YCgoiyxiO8k (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YCgoiyxiO8k)
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Finally, the equipment is coming together where it should be. No need of having 2 museums in the same area. The Gray idea should be put to rest once and for all. The WW&F is the, "new Edaville," done right, and all remaining equipment other than at Phillips should be there.
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It is the long-standing support from many individuals who have contributed their time and treasure to these organizations, no matter the cost or outlook, that have made this collaboration, exhibition and outcome possible. To these folks, we owe a great deal of gratitude.
I hope that those who have offered criticism in the past will embrace this opportunity to help preserve Maine history, and keep it in motion.
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Well said, Ed.
Jeff S.
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Will 4 be operational under Maine Boiler law when it arrives at Alna?
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Are the brakes on the passenger cars from MNG compatible with the WW&F equipment?
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Are the brakes on the passenger cars from MNG compatible with the WW&F equipment?
The only car from MNG that's setup for brakes at the moment is the Rangely. That actually has all the components on it for hand brakes, air brakes, and vacuum brakes.
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#4's is out of service for now.
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Both those videos were fascinating. I wonder, does anyone have contact info for the owners of those "original" trucks? Maybe one of them would like to try for the hat trick...
;D
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B&SR coach 16 coming up I295 in Falmouth.
https://youtu.be/06i1HNNvXO0
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The resolving power of my computer screen isn’t good enough for me to be sure, but it looks as though a cable may be used to winch the cars up the incline onto the flat bed.
When I was an engineering student, in summer 1948 I got a job as mechanic’s helper in the Huntington WV shops of the Chesapeake and Ohio RR so I could be around steam locomotives before they were replaced by diesels. There I saw the winch used to pull dead steam locomotives into the main overhaul building. The motor, drum and controls were all located behind a high, sturdily braced vertical steel plate that was ¾ of an inch or so thick, and the cable was run off the drum through a slot in that plate.
I asked about the armor. Shouldn’t have needed to--by that time I’d had enough physics instruction to know about strain energy. Anyway, one of the guys explained to me that if a cable snaps under the tension of hauling in a locomotive, say one of the C&O’s 2-6-6-6 Alleghenys, the cable ends become wild, lethal animals.
When any locomotive was pulled in with that winch, everybody but the winch operator behind the armor had to get far away or at least behind something massive.
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Postscript to my post about the winch in the C & O shop: It had to have some means of gradually shifting the drum in the direction of its axis as the cable wound onto it, so the cable didn't bunch up in one place, but I've long forgotten that detail. Maybe the set-up was some king-sized version of whatever device is used in a textile mill to wind thread on spools.
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That's good news for both Collections. No private collection or amusement park for any of the Maine 2ft equipment. And most should be under cover by this winter.
Thank you everyone who made this miracle happen..........again.
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Any photos from yesterday's move?
Jeff S.
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Yes - Pictures please and perhaps a list of what has been moved and what, if anything, remains to be moved.
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Yesterday, B&SR Caboose 32 was moved from MNG in Portland to the WW&F.
This move completes the "core collection" as set forth in the "Narrow Gauge Collection" Exhibition (http://forum.wwfry.org/index.php/topic,3374.0.html):
- SR&RL Parlor Car: Rangeley
- SR&RL Combine 14
- B&SR Coach 16: Mt. Pleasant
- B&SR Caboose 32
Also moved yesterday to the WW&F is Monson Locomotive #4. Unless something has changed, #4 is being "passed through" to Maine Locomotive and Machine for storage and (eventual?) restoration.
Today, B&SR SOCONY tank car 14 is being moved from MNG's Gray display site to the WW&F. There will be other similar moves throughout the summer as MNG consolidates its equipment for use in Portland, display, storage, and restoration among the various partners. For example, the SR&RL Vose Inspection Car and B&SR Locomotive 8 are currently scheduled to be stored/displayed at the WW&F.
There are pictures floating around on Facebook. I'm sure our forum will have some soon enough, once the people moving the equipment have the opportunity to do so.
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Cars moved so far:
Prior to July:
B&SR Box Cars #50 (traded to MLM&M for B&SR Flat #34), #51 (MLM&M), #54 (MLM&M), #56 (Currently off trucks in parking lot awaiting restoration), #67 (WW&F near completion)
B&SR Flanger #40
MNG Flat car #205
"The pumpkin": the orange critter locomotive currently on the team track
Moved since beginning of July
SR&RL Coach #19 (Going to MLM&M for storage\restoration)
SR&RL Combine #14
SR&RL Parlor Car #9 "Rangeley"
B&SR Coach #16 "Mt. Pleasant"
B&SR Caboose #32
Monson RR 0-4-4T #4 (Going to MLM&M for storage\restoration pending funds for new boiler)
Equipment pending a move:
B&SR Tank car #14 (just saw pictures of it going on Brian's truck)
B&SR 2-4-4T #8 (will be displayed on a leadout from the turntable)
I don't recall if any additional boxcars are coming from Portland or not. If they did I think they'd still be MNG's but just getting them out of the yard. I know that one of them is going to the temporary restoration shop in S. Portland to be worked on by the MNG restoration crew.
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There should be a point of clarity to Bills post. While all the cars listed were moved from MNG, not all are MNG cars.
Cars moved so far:
Prior to July:
B&SR Box Cars #50 (traded to MLM&M for B&SR Flat #34), #51 (MLM&M), #54 (MLM&M), #56 (Currently off trucks in parking lot awaiting restoration), #67 (WW&F near completion)
50 was given to the WW&F by the MNG in 2018. WW&F had planned to convert it to a flat car when a trade was worked out with ML&M for the remnants of flat car 34 (which ML&M owned). 50 is now owned by ML&M, and joins sister #51 which they had previously restored.
51 and 54 are owned by ML&M. Not sure what exact arrangement was made.
#56 and #67 were both given to the WW&F to restore, 67 in 2017, and 56 in 2018.
"The pumpkin": the orange critter locomotive currently on the team track
The Pumpkin is owned by ML&M. Currently out of service. As with their other cars, I am not certain what arrangement was made.
As for the rest of the cars and equipment bound for the WW&F or ML&M, Maine Narrow Gauge owns them. We are only storing them. We are in the process of creating a very nice display area, where they can continued to be viewed and enjoyed by the public.
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Thanks for clarifying those, Mike. I thought along the lines of that the boxcars were known to be WW&F or MLM&M property.
Also on the list that I forgot to mention is the Vose inspection car, which will be coming up sometime in the future as well.
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Giving no. 4 a push.
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Giving no. 4 a tug.
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No. 4 out and onto the trailer.
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Going for a ride around the parking lot.
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Moving the caboose out of the building and onto the trailer.
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The caboose at the end of the ramp track in Alna.
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Picking up the tank car in Gray.
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Lunch stop.
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Offloading in Alna.
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There's at least two pieces of equipment where the lettering is only one side! Got to get that fixed before the charter this winter. Or turn those cars on the turntable depending on time of day.
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"OR" letter them differently on each side for "authentic" photo runs...!! Just turn them on the turntable.
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Good think'in Bob! :)
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Don't I remember something about how the cupola had to be removed from the B&SR caboose before it could be moved? Or I am confused?
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The caboose could be B&SR 32 on one side and 101 on the other.
Likewise, SR&RL combine 14 could be lettered on the other side as F&M 3 (even though it never ran under that number without its original clerestory roof).
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Apparently the cupola of the B&SR caboose is lower than the highest point on the Rangeley, which is the tallest car from what Brendan told me today.
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At least the accidental removal of the cupola was not historically repeated.
Jeff S.
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Pictures of the pickup in Grey brought back memories from my youth of many Socony gas stations with their Flying Red Horse signs.
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The caboose could be B&SR 32 on one side and 101 on the other.
As far as I know the B&SR caboose never ran as 101 with its cupola, did it? The cupola was torn off by a low wire in Harrison shortly after the Harrison extension opened in the late 1890s. It was never replaced by the B&SR or B&H.
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I need to learn how to use the quote function... :-[
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You're right Dana, which I guess means the caboose can really only be numbered 32 if it has the cupola and not 101, just as combine 14 can really only be 14 with the "flat" roof and not F&M 3.
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In my opinion, this car would be a lot more interesting without the cupola. Your mileage may vary.
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An article detailing the move along with the arrival of the Rangeley was recently in the Wiscasset Newspaper. Read it here: https://www.wiscassetnewspaper.com/article/special-delivery-rr-cars-arrive-alna/121777