W.W.&F. Discussion Forum
WW&F Railway Museum Discussion => Work and Events => Topic started by: Matthew Gustafson on December 19, 2011, 12:53:36 PM
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It was in a day dream of mine where It was about the completion of the restoration of WW&F Steam Locomotive #11. Plus #9 and #10 were on hand to operate along side with #11 and the event was called Steam Days were all three engine operated in together as a triple header. What do think of that idea.
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Ehh? Triple header? Maybe a double header freight and one on passenger always hated that on big steam. Sorry.
Mike
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Matthew -- send money, lots of it!!
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I can't say I've ever seen a photo from any of the original Maine 2-ft railroads that depicted a double-header, much less a triple. Did any of these lines ever use multiple locomotives on one train?
I have witnessed a triple-header at the MNGRR a few years back. I believe Monson 3 & 4 were added as helpers on a train pulled by B&SR 8. Given the diversity in size of the Monson and B&SR engines, the operation just looked strange. I believe that the museum did it more because they could, than for any other reason.
I'll just be happy if I live to see three WW&F engines in steam all at once. ;D
/Kevin
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Sandy River often used double headers on plow extras. Double heading a freight train I think would be a no-no. The stress on the first few cars would be too great, unless the train was of average length and traction was a problem.
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There are photos of WWF #7 and #2 coupled up to double head work or plow trains and there are accounts of that same combination used on many plow trains. Ev Jackson was the engineer on #2 and it was said that "you never had to drag Ev along." I have also seen a photo in "Busted and Still Running" of B&SR #6 and #4 double heading a plow train. Also I have read that a pusher locomotive was often used to help heavy trains make it from Wiscasset to the height of land at Alna Center.
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I had read in Two Feet Between the Rails, where on occassion, if the southbound train had enough cars, the switcher from Wiscasset would meet the train at Head Tide, and act as either a rear train pusher, or take the second half of the train up The Mountain. For whatever reason, double heading only seems to have happened on plow extras.
As cool as double heading would be, I must say, I would rather see two steam powered trains pass each other at Alna Center, or something like that. One being a short passenger consist, and the other a freight consist.
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I was wondering what some peoples thoughts are on trying to hold an annual railfans weekend at the end of August or first weekend in September. I know the Annual Picnic is geared kind of towards railfans, however, it seems as though we are starting to head more towards a Picnic theme lunch, with two or three special trains, and thats about it. Not much for railfans.
So I was wondering if the W. W. & F could set up a railfan weekend event this year, or next year, could we try to make it annual?
My thoughts were to run recreated photo trains every other hour, and try to include two photo runbys per trip. What are others thoughts? And have the event start from lets say 9-6 on Saturday and 8-4 on Sunday? I'm still working on the idea, but would like the Board's opinion before I get to carried away, etc. As far as planning, I would be more than willing to plan out as much of the event as necessary and keep the proper people informed on the event.
Thanks,
Joe
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Sounds good to me, Joe.
The Annual Picnic is fun, but the photo extra(s) tend to be run late in the day when most people from "away" need to be starting for home.
A dedicated "Railfan's Day" would be lots of fun. Every similar such event I've attended at other railroads has been very enjoyable. Planning is the key, and not trying to do too much. Clark's Trading Post prints out a daily "agenda" which lists the planned events and the approximate times they are to start. I've been to several of those weekends and they usually work out very well. They also run some of their regular trains for the public at the same time, between the bear acts.
Perhaps a local antique car club could bring some of their "age appropriate" vehicles to add period atmosphere for photos and videos. And people could dress in vintage clothes to further contribute to the authenticity. Again, it all hinges on planning. I would start with something simple and build on it over the years if the first is successful. Perhaps the first such endeavor could be an extension of the Annual Picnic, say starting in the early afternoon. Regular Picnic trains would run in the morning. Then a more railfan oriented set of trains and run-pasts would run all afternoon. If that works out, then the following year a whole dedicated formal "Railfan's Weekend" could be planned, apart from the Annual Picnic weekend. It's worth a try.
Richard Symmes
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Joe, Dick, it seems like we're already doing most of this. There already is a printed schedule of railfan/photog events during Annual Picnic, for both Saturday and Sunday, morning and afternoon (for best light). People (for the most part) dress in period clothing... and I feel like we've been trying to add a little more each year...
Stephen
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The museum does good to try to add something new during the picnic every year, however, I was just thinking that maybe a weekend where the trains can be run at a more relaxed pace, would be more enjoyable. This could give photographers a chance to actually participate in the photo run-bys. And typically the end of August, to Early September is kind of slow, so I was also hoping that maybe a Railfans type weekend could help boost ticket revenue during that time.
During the Picnic can be hectic during the day, however, the early/late day trips are very popular. Low attendance, but that makes it that much easier to get a great shot, and everybody always comments at how well they go. And I must admit Stephen, that without your extra effort to think of new ideas/scenes, it wouldn't be the same kind of sucess. I feel we are very lucky to have a photographer, like Stephen, to help us plan the photo freights and mixed trains during the Picnic and think up new scenes to have for the event.
Joe
P.s. Now with Albees field so widely open, maybe there could be some new, unexplored camera angles. The Albees farm house is completely exposed, and looks really great, along with the cemetery off to the left of his house.
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In my opinion, if it's a railfan day or photo special day you want, it needs to be a fund-raiser to at least cover the expenses of staging the event. I'm not saying it has to be one of those $250 per person events, but I don't think $50 for the day is unreasonable. But -- and I realize I may be stepping on lots of toes here -- what the WW&F really needs is some public events that can be developed as fund-raisers. The WK&S, where I volunteer here in Pennsylvania, holds no less than 10 special events each year, all of which are extra-fare with special activities. The proceeds of those special runs help keep the doors open, while at the same time bringing in people who probably wouldn't come to the railroad "just for the train ride." I realize that such hokey events as Kids Fun Day, Pumpkin Express or Easter Bunny trips events may be anathema to the purists among us, and there's a lot of planning and extra work involved, but these events put butts in the seats and dollars in the bank.
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Actually, we have been doing a few family related events for a while now. This is our 3rd or 4th year running Easter trains, with an egg hunt at Alna Center, and prizes given to kids that find the prized Easter eggs, we now have the Fall Festival, which has taken place over the Halloween trains, which used to be a big hit, but then slowly declined. The Annual Picnic is dedicated more towards family's, as well as a little railfanny type stuff.
For the Easter trains and Fall Festival, tickets fares have been reduced to make it cheaper for familys during the tough economy, and the trains don't go all the way to E.O.T. and return. They only go as far as Alna Center, and return.
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Joe, I think Wayne's point is that the WK&S uses themed events to raise money...they're not run at a discount. And I think he is correct about a railfan's weekend too. Unless you charge each person $50.-$100. what's the point of going to all the trouble... Also, how would you deal with families that show up to ride the train on that weekend? I think you're talking about turning people away, otherwise it isn't fair to the fans who are paying for exclusive use of the railroad...
Stephen
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Good discussion on this. Regarding the picnic, the last couple of years have brought some great photo ops with special trains in planned scenes. Last year we had a script for the crews to follow as the railcar, mixed train and REA truck met at AC. The visitors I spoke to really enjoyed our presentation.
I've thought about the museum having a railfan event like the John Craft day. The day was planned with everything from a night photo session to sunrise shoot at Albee's field. We could take the best parts of that day and combine them with some of our ideas from the picnic for a future event. One good thing about the picnic's afternoon/evening trains was time. We had time to set up and run the scenes without having to be back at Sheepscot in 40 minutes. A railfan photo extra should be allowed to stay out longer, maybe 90 minutes (as long as #10's coal and water needs are met). Have a schedule with 2 hours between trips so we can set up scenes and more visitors can get the shots they want. For photo freights, charge extra to ride in the caboose, then have a photographers train follow with additional visitors. Things can happen in the yard while the trains are out, including short railcar and handcar rides.
Stewart
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Oh, ok. Stephen, you bring up a good point. I suppose we could do like what Conway Scenic does for Railfans weekend, and run the photo train, powered by steam around the passenger trains. And the event, lets say at a cost of $50.00 per person, for unlimited train rides on all trains during the day, and here is how I propose a schedule.
Steam does all photo trains departing every 2 hours.
52 does all passenger trains departing every 2 hours starting at 11a.m.
Steam departs Sheepscot at 8.00a.m. with a photo mixed or freight train doing runbys as planned and arriving back at Sheepscot at 930 or so, consist gets switched around, and the engine is serviced.
Steam departs again at 10.00a.m with same schedule as before.
Passenger train departs at 11:00a.m. with the understanding that both trains will meet at Alna Center. Upon the passenger trains arrival, the "Photo Train" has clearance to return to Sheepscot. Upon arrival train calls in to station agent at Alna Center, so that the agent can signal southbound passenger train to proceed without stopping at Alna Center.
Etc.
This is similar to how other railfan events are scheduled, and I believe since we already run a similar thing with the rail car, such a timetable/schedule is very do-able. And I was also thinking that if it is found to not go so well the first year, then find other possible events.
What are others thoughts on this?
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This topic went from a triple header to a railfans day. Only one small thought if a "special" event like a railfans day is held I think wide range advertising of the event is a must do. Get the word out by as many routes as possible. Paul C.
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Well, that's another reason why I was asking. Because if it is possible to make an event like this happen, things need to start being planned now, and get in contact with some friends of mine to help spread the word. Thanks to work at Conway Scenic, I have contacts with some serious railfans, that hopefully I can get to come up for the event. Even if we only get 10 people, for just one day, that's $500.00. That would cover the cost of the coal for the day, however, I don't want to sell us out short. I would like to see 15 or 20. And I would also like some other opinions on this. If we can't do it this year, because of short notice, or something along that line, than hopefully next year.
And also need to get the Board's approval, yey or ney, etc.