Author Topic: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread  (Read 17794 times)

Tom Werb

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Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« on: August 01, 2015, 01:43:00 AM »
I'm looking forward to #9's return to steam; hope to get up to Alna to see it.

Question:  Will #9 have working Vacuum Brakes??

If so, #9 may be the ONLY operational U.S. steam loco with working 19th-century Vacuum Brakes.

IIRC, only the SR&RL made a complete conversion to Automatic Air Brakes, but #6 did not
get the Air Brakes before going to the K.C. & W.W. & F.

Extremely-Narrow-Mindedly,
Tom Werb
Preston, CT.
« Last Edit: December 09, 2015, 01:18:55 AM by Ed Lecuyer »
Extremely-Narrow-Mindedly,
Tom Werb

Steve Smith

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Re: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« Reply #1 on: August 01, 2015, 03:19:56 AM »
Yes, I believe it is intended that No. 9 have working vacuum brakes. If you go to Work and Events, then WW&F No. 9 – Official Work Thread, then Page 33 of that thread and scroll down, you’ll come to a picture of Eric Schade with No. 9’s bell that he’s just polished. In the background of that picture you’ll see vacuum brake components lying on No. 9’s deck.

Somebody correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe the black truncated cone is a new vacuum brake diaphragm that was cast using a wooden mold that Eric made.

Jason M Lamontagne

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Re: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« Reply #2 on: August 01, 2015, 03:49:40 AM »
No 9 will have working Eames straight vacuum brakes.  Eric Schade indeed made replacement diaphragms; we're extremely pleased with these reproductions as they are quite close to the original.  They are double layered no6 cotton duck canvas, sewn roughly to shape, coated with rtv silicon (with black pigment) and pressed between a male and female mold (Eric made the male, Ron Ginger the female).  The result is a very rugged rubberized canvas- identical except that Eames (subsequently NYAB) used natural rubber vulcanized at high temperature.  Upon bench testing the very stiff diaphragm began collapsing with less than 0.5psi differential- great!

Jason

Jason M Lamontagne

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Re: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« Reply #3 on: August 01, 2015, 03:53:30 AM »


This is a repost of Brendan Barry's photo from the no 9 thread under work and events.  I think it's page 27 or 29 (I know it's an odd page anyway)
« Last Edit: August 01, 2015, 11:49:23 AM by Ed Lecuyer »

Philip Marshall

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Re: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« Reply #4 on: August 01, 2015, 08:23:12 AM »
It's my understanding that Waynesburg & Washington No. 4 at the Greene County Historical Museum in Waynesburg, PA has working Eames vacuum brakes, so No. 9 will be one of two narrow gauge steam locomotives so equipped -- still pretty impressive!

Now if we can have an entire consist behind No. 9 with working Eames vacuum brakes, that will be really special!
« Last Edit: August 01, 2015, 08:28:52 AM by Philip Marshall »

Jason M Lamontagne

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Re: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« Reply #5 on: August 01, 2015, 01:30:42 PM »
We are actively pursuing that end...


John Kokas

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Re: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2015, 01:46:57 PM »
Jason,

What rolling stock do we have that is vacuum brake equipped? (i should know this but can't remember) And secondly, what would be the plan to equip the cars which are not equipped presently?

Steve Smith

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Re: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« Reply #7 on: August 01, 2015, 05:24:22 PM »
Phillip, this YouTube video, I think made in 2012, gives a pretty good look at Waynesburg & Washington No. 4:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15P7k69-jYA

Vacuum brake pots show at 0:15, 2:30 and 2:40. The ones at 2:30 and 2:40 were obviously not in operating condition at the time. Don’t know what might have been done with them in the meantime

Philip Marshall

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Re: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« Reply #8 on: August 02, 2015, 12:01:32 AM »
Thanks for the video, Steve! That gives a great overview of the engine. Perhaps I was misinformed but I've seen photos somewhere showing the pots on W&W No. 4 with repaired diaphragms in contraction. I don't remember who took them or when they were taken, however.

At the very least, No. 9 will be the only U.S. narrow gauge engine with Eames vacuum brakes in regular operation, which is an exciting prospect!

Joe Fox

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Re: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2015, 12:17:36 PM »
John, Coach 3 originally had vacuum brakes but the only thing left is the old air line. The plan is to install vacuum brakes on the passenger cars just like the original railroad.

John McNamara

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Re: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2015, 07:18:21 PM »
I have some questions about vacuum brakes:

1. Are the couplings between cars somewhat similar to those used with air brakes?
2. Assuming that you arrive at TOM and want to do a run-around, does one close angle cocks on the engine and nearest car, disconnect the hoses, uncouple the cars, run-around, couple the cars, reconnect the hoses, open the angle cocks, and "pump down the air?"
3. How long do the steps in #2 above take?
4. Would all cars in the train have to be equipped with at least a pass-through pipe?
5. Would all motive power (such as #52) have to be equipped?
6. Will supplemental hand-operated mechanical brakes remain?

-John

Jason M Lamontagne

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Re: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« Reply #11 on: August 02, 2015, 09:04:05 PM »
1.  Yes.
2.  Yes, plus a simple brake test proving that the last car on the train responds to a brake application and release.
3.  I suspect the time added to a runaround should be perhaps a minute or two once the crews are trained and used to the procedure.  No problem when Bob C is conducting...
4. The goal is that all cars have operable train brakes.
5.  Yes.  A critical part of the plan is that 52 have a vacuum system, for consistency amongst operations.  We have an active plan to allow this.  51, as a designated track car, would not.
6.  Yes, though they should become parking brakes.

There are several motivating factors:
A.  Safety during Operations down the mountain.
B.  Consistent and appropriate  brake applications.
C.  Promote the use of (cheap) car brake shoes rather than (expensive) loco brake shoes.  Plus, when braking effort is spread over every truck on the train, wear becomes minimal.
D.  Provide a more effective back up than safety chains (they would ultimately go away- once we've field tested the brake system for a couple years).

See ya
Jason

Mike Fox

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Re: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2015, 11:18:03 PM »
I hate to question you last statement about safety chains, but with vacuum brakes, there is no instant on for the brakes, correct? With air, the sudden drop in air pressure applies the brakes. Am I correct in saying the vacuum applies the brake? Or does the vacuum keep the brakes from applying?
Mike
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Craig "Red" Heun

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Re: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« Reply #13 on: August 02, 2015, 11:59:43 PM »
http://www.railway-technical.com/vacuum.shtml

Mike found this on line

Seems like lack of vacuum operates it

Philip Marshall

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Re: Eames Train Brakes - Official Work Thread
« Reply #14 on: August 03, 2015, 12:47:32 AM »
That article describes the UK/European vacuum brake system, but with the Eames vacuum brake used in the US the vacuum applies the brake. Like straight air as opposed to Westinghouse air it's not an "automatic brake", so the brakes don't go on instantly if the train comes apart. However, the Eames brake is supposed to act really quickly and according to historical accounts it worked well on railroads with short trains (<10 cars) that made frequent stops, which is why it was favored on rapid transit systems like the New York Elevated RR.